The Unsolicited Advice and Support Thread

[willpell]

I am going to write on the assumption that part of what happened is that you pushed yourself too hard working on Goblins, and Burned Out.

While I make no claim that my experiences are even close to what happened to you, I understand what its like to work on something, be unable to concentrate on it, or finish it for whatever reason, and hate yourself every single moment you aren't doing it, driving the whole process into a vicious spiral downwards.

I've been there. It nearly cost me my High-School Graduation.

It hurts.

Yeah, this. Creativity is a curse of sorts, even if we're often glad of our suffering. You do whatever you have to do, dude. If you simply can't stand to work on the comic, and just have to post a quick, art-less "how the story ends" before moving on to some other chapter in your life, we'll all be glad to have ever had as much of your awesomeness at our disposal as we did. You have nothing to apologize for; we all wish you the best.

[SGTdude]

Tarol,

You are right in saying you are not a victim. This is basically your fault. And you pretty much screwed yourself for life.

Now that the bad news is over, let me 'splain.

As a guy who had a major breakdown during a deployment to Afganistan, I feel like I know where you are coming from (assuming you had a severe mental breakdown coupled with an anxiety attack(s) so bad that even making a decision as simple as going to the bathroom became impossible and nearly leading you to wet yourself. I am not being hypothetical.

This is your fault because, yes. Ultimately there is something you probably you could have done differently to avoid all of this. But you can no more undo that than you can un-wreck yourself from a car accident. The first thing that needs to occur is that you need to accept that this has happened, and that you are a victim.

You are a victim of your own mind, but a victim nonetheless. And that is debasing and humiliating to accept. It is NOT strange to feel like a 4 y/o kid who is completely incompetent and has no control over their emotions. But hear this one thing if nothing else.

It gets better.

I dont think there is a cure because almost 3 years later I am still dealing with crap. And I probably will be for the rest of my life. But it gets manageable. Especially when you have a loving supportive caregiver (#mywifeisasuperhero).

How you choose to deal with this is up to you. You can take meds, see a therapist, and do other stuff to help as you see fit (I would personally suggest you look in to EMDR because of how much it has helped me), but know you wont cure yourself. You will just get to a place where you can manage this.


You need to take a break from "Work" before you hurt yourself more, but then you need to get back to it because (assuming we have something in common here) our problem is best suppressed when we have a regular routine that is generally stress free. Its not totally suppressed, and that crap will come back up again, but you will learn to deal with it. And so will Danielle. You guys will get through this together if you commit to doing so.


The only thing I can say now is reach out to me if you want cuz I would be glad to talk to you some more about this. Cuz this shit sucks. I know.

So its ok to cry now and be out of control. You will learn to "walk again" and it will be ok.


Thanks

[mememe]

Any mental issues are hard. We like to be in control, if not of everything else then at least of ourselves and this makes things usually not much better.

While noone would think that running against a rock would help to get behind it, we like to think that if it is only our mind, just trying harder will definitely help. And even once our head has understood that it is not so easy, we still believe in some way, that it is. That's why getting told from everybody: "Well, just try harder." hurts so much. Because just sitting down and doing what you did all the time before cannot be so hard. How can brains have such a strange dysfunction that you cannot do something, when just doing it would solve all the problems?

So you start fearing to talk to people, because you do not like being told to try harder. And that can only make it worse. Because now also talking to people about it to got to the list of things you just have to try harder.

It all makes no sense. Noone can be so absurd. How can anyone be so miserable to not even be able to do some simple everyday tasks. How can one even be so miserable to not even be able to be talk to your loved ones about it properly?

Expectations of humans are hard. Usually the hardest is our expectations of other's expectations, especially if they are the mirror of our own expectations towards ourselves.

Running against the rock will not help. Giving up will not help. Running away will not help (you can run away from anyone else, but have yourself always with you but likely lost everything else).
Try to lower expectations, especially those you have against yourself and the perceived ones of others. Just because noone can see your rock, it is there and it gets bigger both by fearing it and by ignoring it.
There must be a way around it. Do not fear to look funny feeling your way around the invisible rock that can well be a invsible rock labyrinth. Or try to accept that you fear. Try to overcome your fear of your fear, but don't waste your energy to run into the rock either. Accept yourself as enemy but do not fight yourself. As alluring as overcoming your weakness is and putting hope in a big finaly try, as easy as it is to just avoid anything haressing yourself in your own eyes (especially if you look at yourself via other people's eyes) is, neighter can work. Work towards accepting yourself and work towards finding a different way.

Your fear is you, you might be standing in your own way, but do not try to push yourself out of your way (how should that be possible). Do not try to command yourself out of your way (if you could follow your own commands, you would not stay in your own way). There must be some other way. But do not run into the rock wall in every direction. You already did that.

[Lady Dawn]

And don't step on lego.

[willpell]

We absolutely should have complete control of our minds at all times. And if that were true, Tarol's disgust with himself over this entire issue would be fully deserved, because it would be completely his own fault for not just deciding to get over it. But the thing about the magnificent, godlike creative power of the human mind is that it is stuck in an electrified jello blob called the human brain, which is locked up in a calcite strongbox called the human skull, stuffed into the top end of (to rip off a quote from Rich Burlew's Order of the Stick) a glorified sausage called the human body. With all those barriers in place, our control is naturally imperfect. The shame that you feel originates from your pure mental source, and would be justified if it was directed at another pure mental being, but you yourself are only half-mind (or more specifically 1/4 mind, 1/8 spirit and 1/8 soul, assuming you believe in those last two); the body is the great moon which eclipses your inner light, a chained rock which anchors you to the world and keeps you from floating off into the void of solipsism. It is tremendously imperfect; it was arguably designed to be imperfect, as its primary function.

Do not be ashamed at your own fallibility, as it is merely a symptom of your presence in this universe - which is both an ultimately transient state, and deeply appreciated by your fellow sojourners on this flawed and fragile prison-planet. You will ultimately escape all your suffering, and in the meantime you can help to alleviate the miseries of others. Feel the nobility of that fact, rather than any guilt over not living up to your own soul-self's unrealistic expectations of you.

[Mec]

"If you're going through hell, keep going."
-- unknown (misattributed to Winston Churchill according to wikiquote.org)

Keep going.
That's all my advice.

[LurksQuietly]

Dear Thunt,

I support you and you are a good person who matters to a lot of people.

This has always been the case.

It's a really good thing to remember, and nice to think about isn't it?

Love,

Sarah

This. Definitely this. Could not have said it better, so I will quote it and say it again.

Thunt, you are a good person who matters to a lot of people.

As has been stated by others before, we care about you and Danielle, so please take care of yourselves above all else. Everything else is secondary. Just know that you are loved and admired by many, no matter what.

[Dellyn is my hero]

Everybody here, cared so much about you and your comic, they were willing to register on here and spend there time to post.

*their

Either that or they came here as a Troll, not everybody's human and not everybody has good intentions. Thunt himself can testify to that.

[Tofu]

In no particular order.,

- If all else fails, hug your teddy!

- Take time to make space for you in your life.

- Nothing is ever *that* important.

- Practice self love. It's hard to do - giving people confuse self love with selfishness.

- Listen to the 'wear sunscreen' song.

(PS, thanks for the thread title change. I heartily approve)

[hammershisfinger]

Hi everybody, came back from a long lurk.

I've been a reader since the brassmoon battle. Goblins is the only comic that I never stoped reading, and I started reading dozens.

But aside from the comic, I really enjoyed the feeling of being close to the author, even without ever speaking to You, Thunt. Except this one time on the chat, when I said that the demoness guarding the orb looked like Raziel from Soul Reaver, but that probably does not count. This comic is constantly in my head. And many times I tried to put myself in Your shoes and asked myself what I would do with the deadlines or with the plot. In fact, we might share some similarities in our ways of thinking

In fact, since the beginning of this hiatus period I suspected deep inside that it was caused by stress overload. So, these words were stirring inside me for quite a while now. Nevertheless, finding words is harder than I imagined it to be. You will probably find it chaotic and messed up.

In short, I had depression. Tried/planned to do some nasty things to myself, was saved by something that could be considered a miracle. Then came out of it.

Long version: a mixture of stress induced by college, opressive environment, betrayal from a best friend, envy from others and other personal problems sent me into a downward spiral of self loathing, panic and depression. I was seeing a dozen doctors, gobbled on tons of meds and nothing helped. My surroundings provided a lot of "advice" on how I should act, deal and so on. But I was unable to wish myself into health. Finally, I took a very long vacation from college, from my environment and friends, and went to a hospital for three moths. Here in Poland we have some mental health facilities that operate partially like a partially closed sanatorium. I participated in a three month program with a group of others. We had different therapy. I came out a new man. Here is what I learned:

->The funniest thing with being broken was my perception of being broken. It is impossible for one to get a right perspective on being broken because of.... being broken. Imagine a broken ruler used to measure another broken ruler. Confusion and chaos ensured.
->You are not to blame for the state You are in. You did Your best to handle life. But, now You have a new perspective of what can happen if You do some things.
->In fact, there is a limit on how much we can handle before we break. Our brains can regenerate and handle stress for a long time, but not forever. As I remember, Thunt, You always put the readers first. But the truth is, You have to rest. I don't mean like on the couch or in bed, but true rest. You are constantly drawing/sketching/planning/tweeting. This cannot last.
->Nobody can be put in Your shoes. You can never fully understan another. Or be understood. Bear that in mind, always.
->A giant portion of ourselves comes from chemistry. Your thoughts influence Your brain's chemical soup. Your brain's soup make You feel and think in a certain way. You can influence Your thoughts. You cannot balance Your brain's chemistry just by wanting it so badly. It will rebalance in time.
->Our perception can skewer everything. Even the best intentions can become accusations and hurt when filtered through our state of mind.
->You are not the only one. Everybody can have a breakdown anytime, just because of reasons. This does not make You any worse. You are a good man.
->Work in small steps. Don't push too fast.

Some of my own thoughts and advice.
->You, Sir, are able to put together a story that makes a whole legion of people cling to the edges of their seats for each update.
->Rest Your mind. We can handle indefinite periods of hiatus. Forget those who call You names for missed updates. We want out favorite artist to be happy.
->Just looking at the sheer number of people that registered or reactivated during this time - we feel for You. Imagine us all lifting our arms in the air and giving You our energy for the most awesome Genki-Dama ever. We will do it again and again, even if this takes time.
->Start doing something stupid. During my stay in the hospital, I stole a janitor trolley and a mop, and used it as a boat and paddle to row through the longest corridor in the building. We used to steal each other's shirts and treat them as trophies. And did incredibly stupid things. It was awesome.
->Remember what makes You happy. Build a tree house or a trebuchet (that would make me happy, at least). It migth feel awkward and stupid at first, but You inner child will re-awake.

Probably, some of the things above sound stupid or childish. Believe me, I know. But I feel for You, man, and it is the best thing I could come up with.

It sucks to have a screwed brain. Don't let it screw Your brain

As a final thought: You, Sir, are an artist. An artist can never be really sane.

[willpell]

->Our perception can skewer everything.

Just as a friendly tip, I think you want "skew" rather than "skewer" there.

[Simon_Jester]

I'm going to pile in with all the people who say "take your time" to Thunt.

My admittedly limited information makes me feel like Thunt can feel... intensely pressured to do things. Prone to thinking "I should do this for someone, but I can't do this, I don't have the XYZ. So I stink."

And I feel that when someone has that problem, the first step in regaining control of their lives is to limit their obligations to what they can do while being happy at the same time.

Nobody is made more happy by repeatedly breaking self-imposed deadlines.

[Pablo]

Dear Tarol,

Having read your tweeted "blog" entry, I suggest you seek professional help if you have not already done so. Now.

[mercenaryscientist]

Hi Tarol,

I've been reading your comic for years now, and it's awesome.

I read that you don't like unsolicited advice, and reading here, jeez, dude! No wonder you don't like it! Holy smokes!

You've put a lot of your world online to see, and from that, I ascertain that you're a dedicated Dad, a loving husband, a clever author, and a skilled artist.

The first two titles, that's your world, same as mine are to me.

The rest can take a back seat.

Following your novel methods of sales endeavors for so long tells me that you'll be just fine. Whether you've discovered it yet or not, just dipping a toe into the River of Sales grants one an insubstantial armor built upon the core elements of the Salesman's Mantra, "water off a duck's back".

You're a good Dad and a good husband. That's all that matters in the long haul.

[Earthen]

Dear Tarol,

Several years ago, I left home to attend grad school. This meant moving thousands of miles away from the man I loved and hundreds of miles away from anyone else I knew. Since I couldn't find a roommate in time, I lived alone in a small rent house. Making friends can take months, and grad students have access to fewer social networks than undergraduates. My loneliness often drove me to seek anything that might distract me from it.

On a particularly miserable evening, I stumbled upon your broadcast on Ustream. You had just moved into a rent house by the sea, and you were drawing the scenes that led to Chief's death while chatting about your new wood-burning stove. I started regularly watching your broadcasts and spending time in the Goblins chat room, where I still occasionally hang out. You have a calming voice, and I've enjoyed getting to know you, Danielle, and the other Goblinites. This made my isolation more bearable as I slowly adjusted to my new location and made friends in my community.

Eventually, I completed my studies and married the man I had moved away from. I am still grateful to you for helping me persist through a dark time in my life. Even though you don't know me, I've come to value you as I would any of my offline friends. If you never completed the comic, I would be alright with that as long as you're happy and healthy.

[kisa360]

Ok since this will be my last post as a Member of the Newcomer Adventuring Party, I figured I would make it a good one. Then I decided to post whatever passes as a thought in my messed up mind instead.

My suggestion is based on assumptions since I donÔÇÖt know Thunt personally, or have a clear understanding of what was going on.

My suggestion to you Thunt is to go see a Doctor. There are many medical conditions that can mess with you and they are not always obvious. Sometimes you wonÔÇÖt even know something is wrong, and sometimes you could just kind of feel ÔÇ£not rightÔÇØ. I feel it is important to see a Doctor and just tell him all the symptoms you have even if you think they arenÔÇÖt important, and donÔÇÖt try to self-diagnose or ignore the problem. I will try to illustrate why I feel this important using myself as the example.

So about 2 years ago I started feeling ÔÇ£not rightÔÇØ with my main symptom being fatigue. About this time I noticed all the commercials talking about low testosterone being the new plague ravaging the world. Since I have, against my wishes, became youth challenged it was easy for me to conclude that this evil beast stealing my testosterone was my problem. The only problem was, that to admit to the theft of my precious testosterone meant I was less of a man. (This is bull by the way, but it is how I felt.) So I waited for the beast to tire of me and move on. I waited a about a year and a half before I gave in and went to see a doctor. In that time I tried several methods of self-medicating to deal with mainly my fatigue. None of them worked, but I do have a pretty high tolerance to caffeine now. For the past 6 months I have seen 2 doctors insisting I need to be treated for low testosterone. They both told me I was wrong, but since they studied for years to learn their trade and I all I had was the internet I determined they were wrong. Thankfully 2 weeks ago I decided that maybe they had used the internet too, but just came up with a different result. So since my doctor says the internet thinks I have Hypothyroidism (underactive thyroid) I figured I would try the witchcraft he called Levothyroxine. Now it has only been 2 weeks, and I havenÔÇÖt had my follow-up bloodletting yet, but I am pretty sure his internet is better than mine since I feel great.
Now you may wonder what this has to do with Thunt since my problem was fatigue , and his is something else. Well the answer is nothing. This has nothing to do with him this is my story pay attention. One thing I have noticed since the medicine started to work its magic is that I really feel better. ItÔÇÖs not just that my fatigue is gone, my mind is clearer, and I am actually happier. What I had not noticed before is that I now believe I was depressed. It is a symptom of hypothyroidism but I never looked past the one symptom. If I had shared everything with my doctors instead of what I thought was important I may have resolved this earlier.

I am in no way claiming this is Thunts problem. I am just trying to show how medical problems can affect you in ways you may not even realize.

Thanks for reading my rambles.

Whatever your issues are Thunt I hope you resolve them quickly and completely.

[Hobgoblin]

My best friend has panic attack syndrome. She couldn't sleep, study, sometimes even eat. She had panic attacks all day every day, with muscle pain around the chest and arms. When she went to the hospital, several times, they always said something like "it's just stress, calm down", they gave her downers and send her home. She even went to psicologists. But those didn't resolve a thing.
Then she went to a great neurologist that explained her of the condition she has, something fairly new to the medical world, and began treatment. She take medicines and she's almost cured.
When you have something like this, you could have all the support you want, from friends and family, but that doesn't change the chemical unbalance in your brain. You need therapy and, with time, you can be cured completely.

[Mec]

Gonna resurrect this thread because this is Unsolicited Advice. (I also see a lot of Unsolicited Advice in other threads, but the community and the mods don't seem to mind).

Thunt wrote in his blog about always being late, and after 10 years of it (on this comic), he's probably always going to be late, so he's just going to accept that, and that's the way the comic is going to be -- if he can make it that way. (Left unsaid is what the advertisers think of it).

I think that's fine as far as it goes. The first step in dealing with a problem is owning the problem. And sometimes it's not even much of a problem. To be sure, it may mean that Thunt can post only 2 projects the size of Goblins in his whole life, instead of 6 projects. So what, James Joyce wrote about 8 books, and Isaac Asimov wrote 800 books, but they both wrote the books they wanted to write.

So my advice is -- take the "regular updates ASAP" off the front page. The word regular does not belong there at all. It's never going to be regular, and that's okay. ASAP does not belong there either. It either means nothing ("whenever it happens is ASAP") or it means the wrong thing.

[Mec]

One more bit of Unsolicited Advice:

Thunt, create a thread for "tell me how to run my business!".
Charge people $10 to post to it.

[Gryphonic]

One more bit of Unsolicited Advice:

Thunt, create a thread for "tell me how to run my business!".
Charge people $10 to post to it.

[RocketScientist]

One more bit of Unsolicited Advice:

Thunt, create a thread for "tell me how to run my business!".
Charge people $10 to post to it.

Not a bad idea.

[ChroniclerC]

As long as we've got a good thread for Unsolicited Advice, might as well use it.

Dear THunt,

In my completely amateur, zero-training, not-a-psychiatrist opinion, you appear to have had a good old-fashioned stress-induced mental breakdown. Now, I say this not to demean you, or what you went through, but in a "know thy enemy" kind of way. You were putting a lot of pressure on yourself, and the signs of it were there had we thought to look for it. I'm sorry we didn't catch it. I'm sorry we didn't try and get you to ease up. I am sorry that I didn't say something sooner, that I allowed myself to stay silent when I should have said something, instead delegating my concerns to the rest of the internet.

Anyway. My Unsolicited Advice is for you to go get help. As in see a doctor. Talking to the Internet is a good start, but we're not professionals. Get your head shrunk and all that good noise.
Listen to your wife; she seems like good folk.
Take a vacation. This bit seems to be making the rounds, and I think it's a good one. Don't draw unless you want to draw. We'll be here when you get back. Heck, ask around, and I'm sure you've got fans who could do guest strips while you're out.
Ease up on the schedule, or do away with this entirely. If you absolutely positively have to do a schedule, do it once a week, or two weeks, or whatever period of time you think you could draw multiple pages within rather than whatever you think your "fastest" time is. If you're late, and can't finishing by the next day, skip that week. If someone would be so upset over a couple missed updates as to "leave" the comic, then screw 'em. Patience is a virtue.

But yeah. Get better at your own pace. If you come back to the comic, do that at your own pace, too.
~ChroniclerC

[outhro]

I am always checking, even if I know it is early or late.
The timer said 3 days from now. Let me look anyways.
It has been a few hours, let me check again.
I am a trained monkey.
Like a baby playing Peek-A-Boo.
OH MY GOD THAT IS AMAZING IT IS HERE WOOHOO!!!!!
When it happens, it will be enjoyed.
I am patient. Good things come to those who wait. If a few days, a few weeks, or even a few months is needed, I am still going to be giddy when it happens. I have been way too busy with work and have missed out the last half year of live drawing. I like this comic, and have been following for..... 7+ years.
The only thing that could ruin any of this: A stone from space hits some super heavy space junk, space junk falls from the sky, cratering the land where Thunt stands, an earthquake opens the earth, his crushed remains fall deep into a mile deep sinkhole, a nearby volcano fills up the hole with liquid rock dragon feces, and I never get to find out the conclusions to these amazing adventures.

I check Goblins comic as one of the first things I do when I get online. I am a Patient trained monkey playing a game of Peek-A-Boo. Let us all eat some cake, take our time, and we will enjoy the next page like always.
Stay away from Volcanoes.

[Punzil504]

I'll keep my unsolicited advice as short and sweet as I can:

You rock, THunt.

And Danielle, you rock too. What an amazing love you two have for each other. It's truly inspiring.

[Krulle]

The best Webcomic person I know (Howard Tayler of Schlock Mercenary) also struggles with some mental issues.

May it be that Howard Taylor and Tarol Hunt have set up and crossover and nobody noticed? Maybe that broke them?

I'm delving through the archives of Schlockmercenary again, and found Kore with the Axe of Prissan, must have been before he came to Thuntworld to search for the "lost" Axe:

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