September 19, 2013: Ding Ding

[jonjoe]

What happens next is FMK go into the final room and claim the Jade Teapot and teleport to Names where they end up battling Kore. Whether or not kin goes with them is still a mystery Since RubyKin might of convinced her that shes being controlled by MinMax.

[Loyal Backstabber]

All of you suggesting that the group can now grab the jade teapot and teleport out of the MoM - look carefully at panel 7, just after PsiMax has won and slid into the red circle with the "You've selected your treasure" announcement.

BARE WALL.

That section of wall was always bare, and the teapot was to the left of the statue, which we can't see. Plus, it said he selected his magical treasure, implying that he had to actually take something to get it.

[Gherkin]

Thinking about it, I guess we won't be seeing another run through for MinMax and Forgath, since the next time he draws his sword will be outside the maze (unless that's a giant red herring).

I do hope they find out definitively why they failed 2 million times before they leave.

[Brings Cupcakes]

Thinking about it, I guess we won't be seeing another run through for MinMax and Forgath, since the next time he draws his sword will be outside the maze (unless that's a giant red herring).

I do hope they find out definitively why they failed 2 million times before they leave.

I assumed it was because they weren't ruthless enough.

[RocketScientist]

No, it's not the change of camera angle. It looks like Psimax slides into blue on his back, and red on his belly.

I believe the flipover was necessary to avoid showing genitalia again. Easy to imagine bouncing and rolling, though.

Oh! I am so not observant about that. I didn't even notice he was naked until somebody in this thread pointed it out. Right, then. Parts. Thanks.

[Gazirra]

Thinking about it, I guess we won't be seeing another run through for MinMax and Forgath, since the next time he draws his sword will be outside the maze (unless that's a giant red herring).

I do hope they find out definitively why they failed 2 million times before they leave.

My current hypothesis is that in each repeat, Kin and Minmax realize their love for each other, and die in an effort to save the other, weakening the remaining party member(s) enough to fail the MoM

[DrinksTooMuchCoffee]

My current hypothesis is that in each repeat, Kin and Minmax realize their love for each other, and die in an effort to save the other, weakening the remaining party member(s) enough to fail the MoM

I thought PsiMax said at one point that they purposefully lose the Maze whenever one of them is killed, as only survivors get to leave and the dead stay dead from the winning party.

[Jochi]

Ruby IS looking at MM in panel 10, while everyone else is still staring at the red circle. And she's glaring. But I think she's pointing with her sword, not preparing to thrust.
I could see a dialogue like:
R: "What the hell did you do that for? We have the reset on manual, and until the maze resets, he was helpless! We could have questioned him before you killed him!"
MM: "He wouldn'a told us anything!"
R (grinning): "Oh, yes, he'd have told us everything, eventually. That reconstructed flesh isn't COMPLETELY invulnerable, and can still feel pain."
Everybody but maybe Onyx reacts in horror...
MM: "And I didn't kill him -- I sent him out of the maze!"
O: "You did both", then explains the reconstructed flesh can't exist outside the Maze, or needs a few minutes to 'set', or something.

[Xavier78]

Why is everyone assuming that reconstructed flesh can't exist outside the Maze? It makes so little sense that Thunt would add that just to destroy it a few pages later, thus making it pointless.

[Iron Sun 254]

Why is everyone assuming that reconstructed flesh can't exist outside the Maze? It makes so little sense that Thunt would add that just to destroy it a few pages later, thus making it pointless.

I agree. If the Maze recognized the body as valid, it should allow it to leave. At worst, he'll be sent back in his home world in a healed version of his own body, but I think the terror he felt is because he desired non-existence and regular death just won't get you there.

Also, even if it can't exist, how would they know? They only just first encountered it minutes earlier.

[AntMac]

Why is everyone assuming that reconstructed flesh can't exist outside the Maze? It makes so little sense that Thunt would add that just to destroy it a few pages later, thus making it pointless.

Yeah. I am not sure about what conventions of gaming say on the matter, but it seems to me that the maze would , logically, do one of two things.

Either send you back with everything you found/experienced/gained/lost in the maze, i.e. all the events that happened in the maze count, and some people come out with repaired purple eyes and swords they find and then make oblivion-lite, others come out as super-levelled purple ringpieces with no friends and a chip on their shoulder . . . or . . .

Send you back with everything reset to how you started, but for the fact that you now have got the single treasure from the end of the maze.

I can see logical reason for both approaches.


It does seem likely that anything you experience in your last, winning run of the maze would stay with you, and everything you experienced in all the other runs was re-set and gone. So resetting you to your base is something the maze is set up to do, right, you come out without XP, memories or loot from anything but your last, winning attempt?.

Why not then a reset one more time, and you find yourself outside the maze with a prize in your hand and no extra experience or even memory.

And then we get the confusion that has resulted from Psimax messing with the machinery. And it maybe looks like he could beat the maze and come out super-levelled and with every prize, but the maze just resets him anyway.

[Kore]

This page is clearly fake propoganda, rather than true story.

1) PsiMax is very smart.

2) PsiMax knows that manipulation of his machine allows everything in maze to be permanently destroyed in "oblivion".

3) PsiMax knows they have all the time in world to figure out how he destroyed his counter and thus remembers and yet says they won't remember.

4) Obvious that others can learn to destroy their own counter and/or Oblivion just him (If you can oblivion everything with a tool, given enough time you might also oblivion just 1 person)

5) Psimax talking just helps his enemy defeat him.

Therefore this is not what really happened and a great conspiracy has manipulated Thunt's mind to make him *think* this is what happened.

[LordWolpertinger]

Welp, a number of folks called it... I love the look of terror and defeat on his face.

Linkie... http://www.goblinscomic.org/09192013/

Yup. Not quite as good as killing him twice, but good enough.
Also, the folk that said if you aren't careful about entering the red circle immediately after the blue one were correct, too. He went back empty-handed, thanks to the momentum MM gave him.
On the other hand, that might have been him dissolving rather than being sent back. We've debated whether Oblivious can exist outside the MoM. What if solidified-IME replacement matter can't? That would mean MM did kill him twice, but it would be bad for Kin, unless they reset and do this all over again.

I'm thinking the 'body' is just a simple temporary construct to stay in until the maze resets. Unlike the healing thing, that body was made solely for temporary use and might not make it otu of the maze giving him oblivion.

[Insane Kitty]

This page is clearly fake propoganda, rather than true story.

1) PsiMax is very smart.

2) PsiMax knows that manipulation of his machine allows everything in maze to be permanently destroyed in "oblivion".

3) PsiMax knows they have all the time in world to figure out how he destroyed his counter and thus remembers and yet says they won't remember.

4) Obvious that others can learn to destroy their own counter and/or Oblivion just him (If you can oblivion everything with a tool, given enough time you might also oblivion just 1 person)

5) Psimax talking just helps his enemy defeat him.

Therefore this is not what really happened and a great conspiracy has manipulated Thunt's mind to make him *think* this is what happened.

1) PsiMax is extremely smart, just not wise enough to use it properly

2) PsiMax is still trying to figure how to do that

3) Psimax spawned after they mentioned the reset is on manual, so he doesn't know that they have all the time in the world. So he assumes that once one of them wins, the maze will reset and the rest will respawn not knowing about the gears.

4) He might have destroyed the counter with the gears, since we weren't shown how he did it.

5) True, but *all* enemies seem to think that telling someone their great masterplan won't do anything as they can't be defeated, just before they are defeated.

[Insane Kitty]

Welp, a number of folks called it... I love the look of terror and defeat on his face.

Linkie... http://www.goblinscomic.org/09192013/

Yup. Not quite as good as killing him twice, but good enough.
Also, the folk that said if you aren't careful about entering the red circle immediately after the blue one were correct, too. He went back empty-handed, thanks to the momentum MM gave him.
On the other hand, that might have been him dissolving rather than being sent back. We've debated whether Oblivious can exist outside the MoM. What if solidified-IME replacement matter can't? That would mean MM did kill him twice, but it would be bad for Kin, unless they reset and do this all over again.

I'm thinking the 'body' is just a simple temporary construct to stay in until the maze resets. Unlike the healing thing, that body was made solely for temporary use and might not make it otu of the maze giving him oblivion.

I think Ruby is going to reset the Maze, but destroy the counter of everyone who is there, so they all remember everything, and make it so everyone respawns with the gear they found, healed and give our group the win by making the maze have a door that opens to the room with the keys right from their door.

[Kore]

1) PsiMax is extremely smart, just not wise enough to use it properly
- smart enough to not say such obviously wrong things.

2) PsiMax is still trying to figure how to do that
- He knows it is possible, therefore he knows it is possible for a *group* of many minds given enough time to destroy a single person permanently which would be easier then entire pocket universe to never exist.

3) Psimax spawned after they mentioned the reset is on manual, so he doesn't know that they have all the time in the world. So he assumes that once one of them wins, the maze will reset and the rest will respawn not knowing about the gears.
- They have all the time in world to figure it out before one of them wins (No need to jump in winners circle before they figure out). If they could flip to manual reset so easily he should know this is also an option.

4) He might have destroyed the counter with the gears, since we weren't shown how he did it.
- which means they could do the same.

5) True, but *all* enemies seem to think that telling someone their great masterplan won't do anything as they can't be defeated, just before they are defeated.
- but he is not on top/winning, he is losing and they have all the time in world to figure out how to make sure he doesn't win, he is helping them to do so.



Clearly this is not the real PsiMax but a horrible Psi raping of Thunts mind to place this false propoganda. Why? Because they are afraid. They are afraid of PsiMax. They are afraid of Kore. They are afraid of You. They know that inspired by heroes like PsiMax you too may join in fight against seeds of evil.

[ForgetsOldName]

As Kin (and Kins) seem to know a lot about the MoM, it is likely that other persons from our reality have crawled it. I suppose it's possible that once upon a time it was full of 216 Saral Caines and Goblinslayers. As we are told that FMK will be returned to exactly the moment when they left, it's possible that another party will walk up and ask them for advice and that party will find the maze with all the mods made by the Kinship and all 216 FMK having won the maze long ago.

It sort of gets murky when you analyze it too much though....

[Loyal Backstabber]

This page is clearly fake propoganda, rather than true story.

1) PsiMax is very smart.

2) PsiMax knows that manipulation of his machine allows everything in maze to be permanently destroyed in "oblivion".

3) PsiMax knows they have all the time in world to figure out how he destroyed his counter and thus remembers and yet says they won't remember.

4) Obvious that others can learn to destroy their own counter and/or Oblivion just him (If you can oblivion everything with a tool, given enough time you might also oblivion just 1 person)

5) Psimax talking just helps his enemy defeat him.

Therefore this is not what really happened and a great conspiracy has manipulated Thunt's mind to make him *think* this is what happened.

"Fake propoganda" is kind of a tautology. Also, the most major problem I see with this theory is the fact that it doesn't include aliens or the government.

And something you may be forgetting is that Psimax is played by someone who's probably much dumber than him, since he's a genius. Therefore, his brilliance isn't actually what it should be, as his player is only human.

As Kin (and Kins) seem to know a lot about the MoM, it is likely that other persons from our reality have crawled it. I suppose it's possible that once upon a time it was full of 216 Saral Caines and Goblinslayers. As we are told that FMK will be returned to exactly the moment when they left, it's possible that another party will walk up and ask them for advice and that party will find the maze with all the mods made by the Kinship and all 216 FMK having won the maze long ago.

It sort of gets murky when you analyze it too much though....

It's pretty clear that people have crawled it. There's no real way they could know what was inside (as they did) if nobody had entered, as there is literally no way to view any part of the inside without being in it.

[Kore]

"Fake propoganda" is kind of a tautology. Also, the most major problem I see with this theory is the fact that it doesn't include aliens or the government.

And something you may be forgetting is that Psimax is played by someone who's probably much dumber than him, since he's a genius. Therefore, his brilliance isn't actually what it should be, as his player is only human.

Fake means fiction, fabrication, lie.

Propaganda means biased. One can have 100% true propaganda by only including facts that make your side look good and other side look back.

...

Psimax is real. The conspiracy is real. Protect yourself before it is too late. And if someone personally knows Thunt, I suggest sneak up behind him and protect him as well, get a hat on him to block the mind rape. Be warned, the enemy may have implanted suggestions to make him resist!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyYFoXV6iAs

[Loyal Backstabber]

Fake means fiction, fabrication, lie.

Propaganda means biased. One can have 100% true propaganda by only including facts that make your side look good and other side look back.

Well, it's true that propaganda doesn't have to have actually fake things or lie, but it's usually at least lying through misinterpreting and emphasizing unimportant things and the like. It's still somewhat of a tautology, but I will conceded that propaganda doesn't have to be fake.

On another subject, I'm really wondering what will happen now. Can they still win the MoM when someone else won? It said that the winners would return home if they entered the red circle, so would it try to teleport Psimax, the winner, out again, then realize that he was already gone, if they tried to enter?

[RidcullyJack]

On another subject, I'm really wondering what will happen now. Can they still win the MoM when someone else won? It said that the winners would return home if they entered the red circle, so would it try to teleport Psimax, the winner, out again, then realize that he was already gone, if they tried to enter?

They don't need to win (DING) or use the exit circle (DING) to exit the Maze of Many. The Jade Teapot has unspecified teleportation powers - it is exactly the kind of item needed to progress the plot quickly. Teleport isn't usually allowed between dimensions, but adding Plane Shift into the Jade Teapot's magical effects would be enough to transport FMK out of this pocket dimension and into reality #156.

[nightarix]

wouldn't resetting with their memories actually screw FMK over? the first room they entered needs confusion to open the exit, if they already know how it works they can't open it.

[RidcullyJack]

wouldn't resetting with their memories actually screw FMK over? the first room they entered needs confusion to open the exit, if they already know how it works they can't open it.

It doesn't have to be confusion about the room though; any kind of confusion will open the door.

But I don't think we're going to see a reset for FMK; this story arc has gone on long enough. Their goal is in sight, the bad guy is vanquished.
Minmax needs to say green (unless "Jade" is an acceptable colour?). Very soon, Jade Teapot is acquired and then KWA-FOOM. "Remember me?"

[Khazar]

When I saw this page I was also slightly confused, but I think the confusion arises from the motion lines. From these lines it appears Psimax slid though the circles, from his positioning he appears to have bounced. Both would work equally well, and it makes no real difference to the comic, but the overlap allows for some confusion.

I think Kin's tail is now 'glowing' green, so that was just waiting for shading.

I do see an issue with 156 winning as well, it is simply a "what-if" and hopefully won't come into effect. The maze is only "designed" (it is said it grew "like coral" in a comic, but I can't find which one) for only one winner, if there are two winners there may be unforeseen consequences. Highly improbable, but what if our reality ended up in Psimax's, or vice versa? Again this is only a what-if, but if I were in the maze and I wasn't absolutely certain, I would reset rather than risk it.

[Kennerly]

wouldn't resetting with their memories actually screw FMK over? the first room they entered needs confusion to open the exit, if they already know how it works they can't open it.

It doesn't have to be confusion about the room though; any kind of confusion will open the door.

But I don't think we're going to see a reset for FMK; this story arc has gone on long enough. Their goal is in sight, the bad guy is vanquished.
Minmax needs to say green (unless "Jade" is an acceptable colour?). Very soon, Jade Teapot is acquired and then KWA-FOOM. "Remember me?"

I think its almost time for Young and Beautiful's prophecy to come true.