DND Ashren OOC

[Nerre]

I cannot imagine how large or small they are. Size category small would mean as large as a goblin, but I don't know if the legs count with that or not, as it would make the spiders body much larger/smaller. Let's just hope they don't carry Kaliss away if he rolls so they are under him.

[Jacon]

Nerra SGT can do whatever the hell he wants with his character. Even if it doesn't make the most tactical sense. Your allowed to suggest what you think he should do but saying he's being unreasonable for doing what he wants is uncalled for. As for the whole armor thing hopefully the new system will fix the issue of ninja looting. Not that it matters much but SGT to the real issue but SGT couldn't have worn the armor anyway. It's to big.

You are being very stubborn and this not only makes not much sense, it ignores most of what I wrote and what good reasons I gave. You also are a healer, like I am also able to fight. So what? A role is not all, especially as some classes are more than just one role. Just look at the definition of Duskblade. You could play your role in both ways that are currently discussed without not acting as a tank. Maybe tanking would be more valuable right now if you used it to help freeing the casters from multiple small spiders than just focusing on one medium spider, so they could cast instead of being forced to fight in melee. This removes more threat than one single spider.

Like I wrote the plate was not your size category, don't ignore that. There was no armor except the shield so far which would have fit you. And you wrote Tokryn did not even look at the chain mail, there was a lot of time before Adrena finally took it.

I am not doing whatever I want. I defined my char in a special way and try to stick to that, but not on all costs. Yes, he might grab things cause he feels strong after ripping of a hobgoblin head and might seem egoistic, but so far nobody did anything about it ingame. You only tried to solve things in OOC mostly, but that is not how a roleplay game works. Most things happen ingame. Your char could have challenged Kaliss over the plate for a brawl, or just have tried it on and come to the conclusion that it just does not fit, or at least complained (IC). If he would find out he is only second strongest, Kaliss would stick to his new rank. I made Kaliss even offer the chain mail to you first cause you are the tank, and I even invented a tradition of his tribe, which helps me play him so he actually will share stuff with persons he sees as weeker. Don't be unfair now and tell me you got no armor cause of me.

I cannot sort out all on myself, you did not much IC and OOC except saying what won't work.
I try to discuss with all and advice and ask for advice where I don't know the rules, but you basically make a suggestion and then not move away much from it no matter what. It seems you are much more doing whatever you want than me. I only do it IC, but you do it OOC, which is worse in my eyes. You took command but did not even ask everybody or roleplay it properly, which made some chars not accept your char as a leader, but you did not react to that and just kept playing him like everybody did. You have to make compromises like everybody else. It won't work if you only expect others to do it. Show a bit more respect to other players please and don't come up with such accusations. I already was irritated by your threat that you are having problems seeing a reason why your char should stick with the group after the game was not even one day old.
In my pen&paper d&d game we got 3 warriors (only one of those is multiclass) and it still works out.

So please cool down and think about this: We are teammates, no competitors. I know the equipment competition sucks sometimes, but that is no reason for such an argument.

Actually I don't like putting so much more time and effort into OOC post discussions, than into the IC game itself, if the discussion is so harsh.

Bro, He wrote a paragraph saying he didn't like ninja looting( which you did wether you meant to or not.) and he would play the character the way he wanted. You kinda want overkill with all that writing, your the one that needs to cool down and let him play his character and both need to let go of the ninja looting cause hopefully it won't be a issue anymore.

Theirs obviously issues with play by post dnd, Issues which I am attempting to fix with updating scheduling and whatever I can do to sort out confusion. I know we had have a bit of a rough path but stick with me here and don't lash out at each other.

As for death, I haven't decieded but I might offer the newly decease slot up to new players.

[Nerre]

"Nerra SGT can do whatever the hell he wants with his character."

And I with mine, but he objected to like half of my posts so far and started most of the discussion, which is where almost all my suggestion arose from. I just don't want to discuss anymore and actually play my char like I want.

And I object to call it ninja looting, I build up a proper background and role-play reason for him doing it, cause I wanted something that showed he had the strength domain. And he will only do it for some items, not for all. I even wrote several solutions to it that could have happened ingame, not OOC. I don't change the behaviour of my char only cause of an OOC complaint, there also has to be some kind of ingame complaint or whatever. While I know what my char thinks, it does not work the other way around.

However, Kaliss will keep wanting stronger items he can use until it got resolved ingame, a new looting system won't change that. It might assign the items to a specific char, but he still would keep up his claim on it. This is why I often don't like OOC-solutions, since they often are none if you really want to roleplay and stick to your char. Making it not fit him is a much easier solution.

[SGTdude]

Jacon, sorry for venting. I will drop the loot concerns.

To the group:
I want to play this game cuz I believe it will be fun. I also want Tokryn to form a team with people that he has nothing in common with (except they were slaves for like 10min IC). I am trying to hold back certain elements of rp'ing my character for the sake of unity. But if we can't come together then I don't really see the point of being forced to travel together.

As far as leading, Tokryn is a reluctant leader (its on his sheet) and I have no desire to party lead. Someone please be group leader so I don't have to be cuz I will only do it if no one else does. [As stated before, i defer to Jacon and the group as a whole.]

I'm sorry for the trouble. Can we please just kill some shit and stop arguing IC so we can actually enjoy this game?

Thanks

[Jacon]

Nerra, it's not your fault that it became ninja looting. It was mine for atomatically giving you the loot before others were given the proper time to also claim or talk about loot. I think most of SGT objections that you talk about had to do with ninja looting so i'm not gonna bother repeating myself on that matter. Just saying though if your character keeps claiming the strongest stuff and your way of resolving that is to challenge them to wrestling match than I wouldn't be surprised if the rest of the group just ganged up on you. Feel free to play your character that way but it might come back to bite you on the ass.

[Nerre]

I am not Nerra. Who is this Nerra you are writing to?

"Just saying though if your character keeps claiming the strongest stuff and your way of resolving that is to challenge them to wrestling match than I wouldn't be surprised if the rest of the group just ganged up on you."
Actually that would still fit into his mentality. I can roleplay it so it does fit: He might not see one of the individuals as stronger cause of that, but them all together, which would make him obey if more were for whatever was to be done than against (as long as no magic or sneaking is used on him). Like I said: Give me a good ingame reason and I can change it.

[I'mBob]

Kaliss finishes the spider facing him as major action. If it is possible as minor actions after that, cast a simple level 0 healing on Cade to stabilze him. If not possible, just stay with Adrena, backing each other up.

For your general knowledge Nerre:
Most spells are at least a major action. Some are more but very few are less. The only one I can think of which is less is "Feather Fall" which is a free action, but that's it.

Also, there is no such thing such as "minor action" in the 3rd edition, as far as I know, it's a 4th edition only thing. (Maybe it was in an earlier edition though, I don't know).

Hope that helps

[SGTdude]

I would like some help on this too.

I'm assuming in a combat round we can do one of these:
Attack
Cast something
Heal someone
Or take an otherwise physical action

And one of these:
Move
Speak
Get an item
Use an ability like sneak/etc.

Jacon can you clarify on this issue?

[SGTdude]

Jacon I think the image has to be uploaded to the internet in order to be posted directly into the message. Other than that I am not sure what happened.

[Quarg]

Is my character still pinned to the ground by the web?

[Jacon]

Uh right questions.

Int is done at the start of combat. I roll it and you get + your dex to the roll. Once the roll is made it does not change until the end of combat.
SGT you are correct on your actions. You also get a minor action ( I don't know if this is a 4th edition idea or not but I use it.) Minor actions are usually something like getting a item out of a bag, passing something to someone else, knowledge checks etc. Some minor are also dailies and these usually give you extra bonus and whatnot mattering on the daily.

The spiders are either med or small. Sometimes in writing i'll say large to fluff it up and that can get confusing. Thats part of the reason why I added the info stats so you can just glance at it and the info on it usally correct.

Adrena is still stuck by web. Sorry I didn't add that to info.

as far as a map goes. I'll keep working on trying to figure out how these libiray computers work so I can upload one. They don't really save to the computer and I can't find it once I search for the saved map. I'll see what I can do. DOn't expect anything awesome if I do it get it to work. It'll just be some quick drawn shit to give you a idea of placing.

[SGTdude]

ok. I think one of us could do a rougue-like map also in paint real quick if needed. The problem there is just that if we dont put a monster in the right spot, then you have to correct it and we have to reupload it.

Of course if you want to be more descriptive about where stuff is in your posts that would help one of us to make a map (but that kind of makes extra work for you). It may not even be a big deal, its just something I thought of.


But how did I have an initiative of 9 if my dex is 10?

[Jacon]

you rolled a 9 +0 so 9.

I'll try to be more descraptive where things are but it'll properly never be as good as a map . ( Another thing as to why the info stats exist)

[SGTdude]

Doh! Dex bonus not dex score. I will try to make mspaint maps then (warning: eyes will bleed) unless someone else wants to. Also you can count on me to be the health tracker. Next time there is something worth mapping I will try it.

So how does one raise a low stat (other than permanent magic or item granting the bonus?)

[Quarg]

So how the hell did I get a Initiative of 2 when my Dex bonus is 3????

[Jacon]

Thats properly just a dm error. Maybe I mistook your sheet for someone else and use the wrong int bonus. Doesn't matter that much cause the order would not have changed,

[Jacon]

Dailies suggestions.

Glandalr.
Summon a swarm. You summon a swarm of other worldly insects to do damage. Do a instant 2d6 points of damage to a target for two rounds. In the future the swarm can be upgraded to be either hellish ( more damage and fire.) Or celestial ( some damage and healing.) Or continue to just be offworldy ( More damage, more targets.)

Summon powerful creature: Summon a random powerful creature to your side. ( higher summon monster spell.)

Cade:

Bounding confusion: You bound around a target making him confused and unable to move. You gain a 4+ to ac for a round and cause a target to become imbolized.

Crippling strike: One of your sneak attacks does a extra 1d6 points of damage and the target takes 2- to attack and ac.

Bleeding strike: Do a extra 1d6 points of damage in a sneak attack and the target takes 2 hp every times it's his turn till he gets it healed or stops the bleeding.

[SGTdude]

So tempted to be like "oh we totally taking your loot now!" and go back, but its too far and we risk getting attacked again. But I do want to come back here later for some payback.

Hoping we can have at least one significant update between now and monday (if not more, please?)

[I'mBob]

I like the swarm idea. I will take it.

[SGTdude]

you guys both picked really good dailies. Im looking forward to seeing them in the game!

[SGTdude]

So.... I dont want to split the group.


None of this is personal, its just roleplaying. Tokryn is taking Shiro's freedom very seriously until he commits an act that suggests he shouldn't get that freedom. I do not see why (whether IC or OOC) this should split the group. I know he captured the group and there is this whole "we want vengeance dammit!" thing going. But also without him Cade would be dead. That is pretty much a fact cuz I would not have gotten there in time. I would have likely survived the longest (with Kaliss perhaps) because of my daily, but Im pretty sure someone else would have at least gone negative if not died. And he had no reason to stay.

If that isnt reason to give him a chance then maybe the group needs to split up.


I dont want that to happen and in reality am just asking for like this one little thing, ok 2 things: work together and dont kill the NPC.

You guys let me know what you want to do for the good of the game as a whole.

[Nerre]

Would have been nice to wait a turn to let me react to the sense motive result, or don't let Shiro insult me right from the start and even more now. Now he is already gone and I cannot make my char do anything positive about it, except attacking him for his insults. Some of the insults he used were heavy enough make Kaliss attack, "backwards god" for example or "You really missed your calling as a slave oh high priest". Not a lethal attack, but at least hitting him. I wish I had gotten any roleplay signs that would have told me or my char earlier that Shiro can be trusted. But it was written like he cannot. It did not seem that you want to give him to us as an aiding NPC. He seemed rather like a plot device, a traitor and cunning slaver, luring us into a trap. He even did betray us for a turn and did not care about some of us being killed (to Adrena during spider attack: "Guess paying that toll was worth it after all. Good luck elf, in this life or the next." He cuts the donkey free from the cart and leads her a few feet down unto the path.). He even saying something sardistic back then. Yes he came back, but it did not seem like it was cause of a bad conscience.
That is just inconsistent. Like him working with slavers and now being so ethically sober like he was a good guy all the time. He insulted my char all the time and same for Gendalr, how else should I have reacted than with hostility and distrust? That just does not fit. Writing him a bit nicer or empathetic would have helped. Also, making camp so close to the witch was not Kaliss idea, he did not like it but gave in to the group after Adrena and Tokryen did suggest it. I only worked with what I read. I know my reading-between-the-lines is not that good in english, but I havent had it that bad for a long time, maybe never. Nothing read even remotely like what you just wrote in the sense motive spoiler. Now turning it 180┬░ around against my char is not fair and really sucks. Damn. Should have done the sense motive earlier or ask for a hint. Now it is too late and there is a huge inconsistency that I don't have any idea how to repair it. Kaliss tried to keep the group save, a noble motive, despite of having a slight traumata from the abduction and enslaving.

Now me and my char stand there like an idiot for bossing around the "nice coachman that only worked for the slavers, but did not share their ethical point of view and only wanted to help us", as he seems now.

I honestly don't know what to do now.

I just cannot roleplay "Oh, your insults are so fine, dear sir, please stay with us and have tea.". This is against every roleplay sense and credo I developed so far. I am not even sure if it would break the char to not let Kaliss hit Shiro for the insults against his god. It is a god of strength, so stepping back now and just ignore the insult would be like showing a weakness. This might cost my char the support of his god. We had a cleric once who did not stick to the credo of his god and could not cast anything for two ingame weeks as punishment.

[Jacon]

Rocks falls, everyone dies. Seriously though I didn't nearly have these many problems in my last game. I wonder where I want wrong.

1, it was never written that Shiro cannot be trusted. You just took that way ( With reason of course.) He's a slaver, proven not be a good guy but he's also given sound advice and been generally decent to Tokryn who has treated him well going as far as to cook a meal for him. He came back to help with the spiders for some reason or another which suggest he has some reason to wanna keep the group alive. If he's not empathetic to you it's cause he doesn't like you and he has multiple reasons for that as well.

2 Sense motive check. It's post by post dnd. It's a bitch and we don't get information we'd like at all points. Shiro was just reacting to your arguement which was cannon.

3: I'm removing Shiro has it's obviously not fun for players to argue over him. Thats why he's leaving..

4: This isn't a game where i'm standing next to you and I can give you all the info I want. It's hard to deliver all the information a player might want and continue the story at a reasonable price.

Seriously though, both your characters have to settle your differences or the game won't be fun for anyone. Theirs nothing I can do about that except remove the more troublesome elements.

As for the rping. Either your character can take a swing at Shiro or i'll edit to have Shiro have a more quiet exit.

[SGTdude]

I hate to say it, but if kaliss fought shiro one on one and killed him that would solve some problems.

As far as tokryn and kaliss....I don't know. Honestly tokryn agrees with shiro's assesment and then some. I don't want to get back in to combat but I think if me and kaliss were alone and got jumped and survived I think it could mend a lot of bridges.

I'm just glad the "shiro arc" is over even though I wish he could have remained. I'm gonna post ic in about 2hrs so if you are gonna edit shiro leaving can you do it before then?

[Nerre]

If everybody would be cool with that, I would post it and we just kept playing from that on. Took me like 2 hours to make them sort it out with a POSITIVE solution, trying to keep all three as much in char as possible, so I would be glad if I did not just waste that time. I know SGT already posted something else, but maybe we can undo that post if you agree, that this is a better solution.

what you say, SGT, should we brawl this out? I assume your char would join against Kaliss if he would hit Shiro.

It is not the way I solve things as a person, but I heard that many man let out steam like that, sometimes even a friendship started with a good fight after the piled up hate and anger was bashed out of each other. So I came up with this:

Before:
Kaliss "To hell with you slaver!" hits Shiro, but not using his claws.
Tokryen "I said he will not be harmed!" charges at Kaliss.
Shiro "Get off me, lizzard scum!" fights back.

Afterwards:
All exhausted on the ground, after taking like 2-6 non lethal damage.
"Why the hell did you enslave us, you bastard! Really, I want to know how you justify that." Kaliss coughs.
"What you are taking about? I only picked you up and were to deliver you to my warlord! My cargo was slaves often, but I don't enslave people." Shiro mutters.
"Why didn't you tell us right away? See, I said he was okay!" Tokryen says.
". And he fought with the guards when we fought for our freedom." Kaliss still is not fully convinced.
"If there is a battle of life and death, I normaly pick the side which does not try to kill me. Sorry that I wanted to live." Shiro says.
"You did not help Arena when the spiders came, but made a joke about her maybe dying, then you left!" Kaliss continues.
"He came back!" Tokryen intervenes.
"And you did not guard him like you promissed..." Kaliss coughs again.
"I did as best as I could!" Tokryen mutters.
"He did not need to guard me. It took me a moment to realize I owed all of you something after you decided to let me life. Even if it was Tokryen who convinced you to do it. I just did not want to get drawn in. The spiders did not attack me, cause I had payed my toll to the witch. So I already paid back my debt of you letting me live, when I joined the battle and helped when i did not have to."
"Hmm. Maybe you were right about the chestplate. I just thought she would not care for it, only for his gold. But at least I left the gold for her." Kaliss says.
"Actually..." Cade starts to confes with a low noise, but they are too tired to look up, and both Tokryen and Kaliss know he took it anyway, so they just say "We know."
"He took it?" Shiro asks "That explain a lot."
"Seems we maybe caused the attack then, Cade." Kaliss admits. "This is why only we got marked. Maybe we should go back and return the things to her."
"You maybe aren't as stupid as I thought you were in the end." Shiro says.
"You really want to go back?" Tokryen asks.
"There is still the insults between us, Shiro. Especially the one against my god. Do it again and I will use my claws ne-" Kaliss says, trying hard to be diplomatic.
"Sorry, I did not see it as that important to you. Most humans are not very religous, only in times of need." Shiro interrupts him, then adds "But you really earned some of those 'insults' " as he sees that Kaliss anger and hate had cooled off a lot.
"And you really earned to be killed for fighting against us. But we did not." Kaliss replies.
"How about not insulting and killing each other from now on then?" Tokryen intervenes.
"If he doesn't insult my god anymore, I might be able to do that." Kaliss replies.
"Deal. I will try to keep my mouth shut. At least about your god and folkways." Shiro agrees.
"You really want to go back to the witch?" Tokryen repeats his earlier question, moving the topic away from the argument to dealing with the problem of the witch marks on Cade and Kaliss.
"Well, it is worth a try. At least if Cade also is willing to give back the gold. I cannot take this itching much longer, it drives me crazy!" Kaliss says.

► Show Spoiler

I thought Shiro was their leader.
"1 human, fat, leader of the slavers, mace, wooden shield, chainmail." <= was this Shiro or another guy?