18 September 2015: back up

[Krulle]

Imma boop you on the nose with a new #Goblins! Boop! goblinscomic.org

[edit]

Apologies for the stupidly long wait. I spend SO much time trying to get my internet fixed. But all is well now.

Dang, forgot to add this tweet in...[/edit]

"You dummy." - How sweet!

Permalink : http://www.goblinscomic.org/09182015/

[elkhantar]

Man, after maybe 10 years lurking? this comic finally made me register just to say how sweet it was. I was reading this with my toddler and I can't even describe how warm and lovely that felt. Way to go, Tarol.

[Krulle]

Welcome, elkhantar.
Yes, precisely because I'm a dad I liked this page very much too....

[Talos]

It's a cute page, but inconsistent with their earlier interactions. Keep in mind that in-universe, only a few weeks passed since MinMax swore to kill all of the goblins, to the faces of this group, no less. Yeah, characters can change, though this seems to be rather quick. Of course, in reality, at least a decade has passed. I think this might set some sorta record for a gap between real time and webcomic time.

Still, Fumbles is cute. Nearly useless, but cute.

[HerdsCats]

That's the thing about us humans. When it comes down to it, we will bond with damn near anything. Minmax had just lost everything in his little world. Kin hates him now, and forgath is "dead". What more does he have except for the creatures standing in the room with him? The goblins still don't like him, but it seems like it's been decided that as long as they're in the dungeon, nobody is going to go out of their way to kill him. He can go get himself killed, but that's no skin on their noses.

Right now Fumbles is the only friend he's got.

I don't know... when I started typing this I had a point I wanted to make. For the life of me I can't remember what it was, other than the fact that "don't get yourself killed you big dummy" really reminded me of the birthday party and Minmax telling Kin he was glad she was alive.

[Zathyr]

Maxo Kickaxo clearly need each other, at least at the moment. Minmax was the first one to treat Fumbles normally after his ordeal. It may not have been a lot of time since the attack on the warcamp, but Fumbles has been through a lot since then. And Minmax has lost everyone he loved, so ... yeah they're an odd couple.

[Sessine]

What's interesting to me here (in addition to the awwwh-sweet moment at the end) is the self-awareness demonstrated in panel five. Minmax knows it's a bad idea to go back up there? So at least some of his previous bad ideas -- like pissing on the sword, maybe -- were proposed in the full knowledge that they were bad ideas, relying on a friend to stop him. This would be really odd, except...

This is a game, with players. That meta-level does show through from time to time, sometimes very obviously, as when characters talk about levelling up or the nature of a magic item, but sometimes more subtly, as here.

Minmax's player is a very smart guy roleplaying a dumb character -- very well. The 'propose-bad-idea, get-stopped' is a running gag he's been using all along for its comedy value. Here, he's got himself into a jam: Minmax absolutely would try to go back up there to get the loot. In-character, there's no way he wouldn't. The player had to say it. But the two other characters who'd been stepping in all along to save him from himself aren't with the party any more. Panel five is him looking at the other players around the table and going, "Guys? C'mon, you guys..." And they're all looking back at him deadpan, aware of his dilemma and just leaving him hanging... which makes panel six hilarious.

In fact, only Fumbles' player has any in-character reason to stop him, which leads to the rest of the page -- and a pivotal development in the relationship between the two characters.

Well done!

[SamWiser]

Great page. Very cute.

--Cut--

I know this has been debated forever, but has there been any signs one way or another that the goblins are actually PC's? I don't think we've seen any proof of real people controlling their actions, like we have with Forgath and Minmax.

[spiderwrangler]

I know this has been debated forever, but has there been any signs one way or another that the goblins are actually PC's? I don't think we've seen any proof of real people controlling their actions, like we have with Forgath and Minmax.

Herbert at the very least...

[SpeaksManyLanguages]

I'm with Talos on this one. I felt an emotional disconnect from the page and the suspension of disbelief kinda broke down. You know, like a feeling that this is not characters acting on their own, but the author forcing them to do something... That's my impression.

[StaysUpTooLate]

Man, after maybe 10 years lurking? this comic finally made me register just to say how sweet it was. I was reading this with my toddler and I can't even describe how warm and lovely that felt. Way to go, Tarol.

Yup. With all that both Minmax and Fumbles have lost, they seem to have found an unlikely friend in each other.

[Sessine]

Great page. Very cute.

--Cut--

I know this has been debated forever, but has there been any signs one way or another that the goblins are actually PC's? I don't think we've seen any proof of real people controlling their actions, like we have with Forgath and Minmax.

Well... if this page doesn't count as proof, then something very, very odd just happened.

I see only three possibilities, logically speaking, for the Goblins:
!. They are player characters. They were originally being run as a separate adventuring party, but plotlines have merged.
2. They are NPCs controlled by Herbert. Most of their adventures so far were written by Herbert for his own private amusement because... um, some DMs can just be like that? maybe he's a wannabe novelist, or
3. They are some weird independent manifestation of sentience created by the world itself.

Under Hypothesis 2, Minmax's player is on a solo adventure surrounded by Herbert's NPCs, and... nah, I can't buy it. Dynamics are all wrong.

Hypothesis 3? I don't even... well... maybe, but you gotta admit it's really weird.

The page simply makes the most sense - and is funniest - under Hypothesis 1.

[Orzahn]

Minmax seems totally and utterly lost, I feel for him. At the same time I completely understand the goblins, they would've killed him but Thaco and Big Ears prevented that from happening, but not killing him doesn't mean they are going to save his ass. It's vorpal who went though shit, by human hands who is willing to reach out to the human who they found now. Just because Vorpal is that sweet. And I am happy this doesn't turn too angsty, it could be with a fumbles who goes catatonic whenever he sees a human, and an outright hostile group who are only not killing him because the paladin grudgingly said so.

[HerdsCats]

Another thing to keep in mind too, is that despite the horror that Fumbles went through in Brassmoon, the first person to truly reach "him" was Minmax. By helping him with the mustache, embracing (not just accepting) his silly dorky persona, and just now, attempting to save his life when the trap sprung again - all these things add up to being able to accept maybe not all humans, but certainly this one.

On Minmax's end, he is beyond lost and with nobody else to turn to. If they weren't locked in a dungeon crawl, I could see him having simply left the goblins hours ago, without ever taking the time to get to know any of them. But because he was forced into it, he and fumbles wound up bonding. They really are cut from the same cloth. Now Minmax sees fumbles as a second chance, a friend he can maybe protect this time around, even it he doesn't realize it on a concious level.

I'm wondering if the topic of kin will ever come up. After all, it was Complains who couldn't hold on to her. If she does come up, will that change MM's opinion of his nemesis?

[Morgaln]

Great page. Very cute.

--Cut--

I know this has been debated forever, but has there been any signs one way or another that the goblins are actually PC's? I don't think we've seen any proof of real people controlling their actions, like we have with Forgath and Minmax.

Well... if this page doesn't count as proof, then something very, very odd just happened.

I see only three possibilities, logically speaking, for the Goblins:
!. They are player characters. They were originally being run as a separate adventuring party, but plotlines have merged.
2. They are NPCs controlled by Herbert. Most of their adventures so far were written by Herbert for his own private amusement because... um, some DMs can just be like that? maybe he's a wannabe novelist, or
3. They are some weird independent manifestation of sentience created by the world itself.

Under Hypothesis 2, Minmax's player is on a solo adventure surrounded by Herbert's NPCs, and... nah, I can't buy it. Dynamics are all wrong.

Hypothesis 3? I don't even... well... maybe, but you gotta admit it's really weird.

The page simply makes the most sense - and is funniest - under Hypothesis 1.

I don't buy it. There is no indication whatsoever that there are actual players behind the goblins. They never break character; they never refer to things outside the world they live in, not even Herbert. They don't display any knowledge they shouldn't have. None of the other player characters ever managed that, not even Forgath.
Personally, I think the creator of the comic himself doesn't have any idea what they are. The instances where player characters come up are cheap throw-away jokes and he never considered what they mean for the congruency for the story.

[Aegis J Hyena]

I missed the boop so just saw this comic now. Maybe it's just an establishing shot for a greater emotional tie from Minmax, since he lost Kin and Forgath.

HerdsCats has it right. If Kin's brought up, there might be trouble right then and there.

[sunphoenix]

... I don't have any big insights as to weather the goblins are truly PC's or NPCs... Does it really matter anyways?

What I do know is this...

This page made me smile.. and feel.. loved inside. {Shrug}... that's all that really matters to me.

THANKS Thunt! {Teary smile!}

[HerdsCats]

Tbh I can see it going either way with the topic of Kin. She did mention how she thought the govlins she'd met in Brassmoon were really brave and also not evil. And they HAD tried to save her. It was only Complains' broken arm that prevented it.

It depends on exactly how committed to the whole "nemesis" thing Minmax is. If he's really committed to hating Complains, it will go badly. If he's not, it could go really well, and MM could feel like Complains went through the same thing he did in trying to save forgath and failing.

[RocketScientist]

Fumbles is adorable.

ETA: I wonder what will happen if the subject of Goblinslayer comes up...

[Shax]

popping in to add a "DAAAAAWWWWW! SO CUTE!"

As far Minmax's character goes; if anyone can change quickly it's him. Well, sometimes. For example:

• starry eyed over his personal hero(goblinslayer), sees something he didn't like and after 5 seconds of thinking goes "bro, you're dead to me"
• Insists on killing kin, half a day later she's part of the party. one week and he's in love.
• flashes of brilliance during battle, like the belt buckle. Most of these involve releasing his normal approach isn't working so he throws a curveball at it.

All of this is compounded by the fact that people can and will change rapidly when dealing with extreme and unfamiliar situations. Either that or breakdown.

[Fletcher Green]

Dear Thunt,

I have been reading goblins since the goblin adventures opened the chest they were supposed to be guarding.
This panel may not have been the most intricate or complicated of all of your amazing artwork, but the story "twist" here makes this my favorite panel ever.
I too registered today (like more than few others it seems) so I could post this comment.

Thank you.

[Lady Dawn]

Forced? No, I like how the character Minmax is getting transparent, showing the player behind him. Because I can relate to that kind of roleplaying. I too like to play characters that start a certain way but are very open for growth through whatever is thrown at them. I like to troll others a little to make fun story elements.
I like how the goblins, being the actual good guys, not being too goody goody and actual hold some quite realistic grudge and cynicism.
I like how Fumbles matches Minmax in several elements of roleplaying. Not just in being an initial powerplayer, but also in mainly wanting to make enjoyable interactions.
I wouldn't be surprised if Fumbles is an actual player character. He was probably on a hiatus so Herbert made him catatonic.
But I also like the idea that the goblins might neither be NPC's nor PC's. It fits the story how they break the rules.
But who knows... Once a character has a sheet, at some time a player might decide to play it.... Character sheets are a lot like souls in this way.

Darn...I miss tabletopping...

[RocketScientist]

popping in to add a "DAAAAAWWWWW! SO CUTE!"

As far Minmax's character goes; if anyone can change quickly it's him. Well, sometimes. For example:

• starry eyed over his personal hero(goblinslayer), sees something he didn't like and after 5 seconds of thinking goes "bro, you're dead to me"
• Insists on killing kin, half a day later she's part of the party. one week and he's in love.
• flashes of brilliance during battle, like the belt buckle. Most of these involve releasing his normal approach isn't working so he throws a curveball at it.

All of this is compounded by the fact that people can and will change rapidly when dealing with extreme and unfamiliar situations. Either that or breakdown.

It was a long five seconds of thinking.

[JustRight]

popping in to add a "DAAAAAWWWWW! SO CUTE!"

As far Minmax's character goes; if anyone can change quickly it's him. Well, sometimes. For example:

• starry eyed over his personal hero(goblinslayer), sees something he didn't like and after 5 seconds of thinking goes "bro, you're dead to me"
• Insists on killing kin, half a day later she's part of the party. one week and he's in love.
• flashes of brilliance during battle, like the belt buckle. Most of these involve releasing his normal approach isn't working so he throws a curveball at it.

All of this is compounded by the fact that people can and will change rapidly when dealing with extreme and unfamiliar situations. Either that or breakdown.

It was a long five seconds of thinking.

It takes some guys a little longer. Minmax is one of my heroes because of this - a very relatable part of the "Never Give Up, Never Surrender!" school. He deserves a friend.

[SpellsBedly]

Well... if this page doesn't count as proof, then something very, very odd just happened.

I see only three possibilities, logically speaking, for the Goblins:
!. They are player characters. They were originally being run as a separate adventuring party, but plotlines have merged.
2. They are NPCs controlled by Herbert. Most of their adventures so far were written by Herbert for his own private amusement because... um, some DMs can just be like that? maybe he's a wannabe novelist, or
3. They are some weird independent manifestation of sentience created by the world itself.

Under Hypothesis 2, Minmax's player is on a solo adventure surrounded by Herbert's NPCs, and... nah, I can't buy it. Dynamics are all wrong.

Hypothesis 3? I don't even... well... maybe, but you gotta admit it's really weird.

The page simply makes the most sense - and is funniest - under Hypothesis 1.

Canonically it's option 3. The goblins are NPC's in a campaign world who have declared themselves PC's, they are independent minds running on the same rules as RPG characters.

Minmax though has a player. It doesn't come up much anymore, and it generally doesn't make much of a difference in terms of how he acts, but in this case it can be argued that his player is finding a way for him out of the situation by outright telling the Goblins, in character, because there is no out of character for them, that he needs to be stopped.

Ignoring that angle one could argue it's just good character development. Minmax still acts impulsively, but has gained a small amount of reflection on his previous actions. It's not a stand alone development, the though process to get to "struggle really, really, really hard" was an improvement over the one leading to "I'm going to pee on it!". Minmax is getting a bit less impulsive and more experienced. Maybe he even gained a point of intelligence or wisdom somewhere along the way?